so what happened to the page four reply, oh I see UES deleted it, is this personal censorship or is it a partyvibe thing, would you please explain what I said that is so wrong or is it because you dont like being wrong or being told by “people like me” or you dont like it when your argument cant stand up by itself.
copyed from page 3 😉
“elraveon
This message has been deleted by USE. ”
I cant believe this site has come to this, Use you profess to stand for free parties, not free speach tho, wot a laff.
you might aswell put it back up and argue why you did it. I know other moderators saw it. and basicly the deleted post just quotes what this site says plus some explanation backing up my view
so what happened to the page four reply I made this afternoon, oh I see “USE” deleted it, is this personal censorship or is it a partyvibe thing, would you please explain what I said that is so wrong. I am rewriting it as it wasnt long, heres all I can remember you post bandit, mostly as it was, I should of saved it as I write in word first but others saw it anyway including other moderators so some explanation would be appriecated. here it is again 😉
written by use private parties arent free for anyone to come, so they are not free parties! read the front page of the site, it puts the thread in context.
i’ve changed the title, now, you pedantic old bastard. .
happpy????? no i didn’t think so. people like you never are. why do you feel the need to spread you poison onto other people as well? just lock yourself away, and stay there. you’ve been tryong to hijack this thread to fit into your narrowminded veiw of the world from the start. and its not helping anyone.
your view above is twisted and nasty.
(im sure I worded this bit better but its the jist but not as clear)
We all go to freeparties and we are all members of the public but we meet as a group of private enthusiasts and friends invite friends but public parties need tickets for all intents and purposes they seem private once a member of the public has purchased his ticket.
Private (free)parties only need an invite albeit by private means or to be more correct “not done for the public, so they can seem more open because they are not bound by the licensing restrictions but they can still fall foul of other laws. and if you don’t want to lose your system, your equipment, your records DJ’s are also liable, up to £20,000 fine and or imprisonment. You don’t say its public or advertise in the public domain as in open freeparty forums. I thought recent cases should of taught you this.
Your change of title still doesn’t make sense because raves are already legalized.
Yes I have read the front of the site and Dereks piece is very good on “what a freeparty is”
written by Derek A big requirement of a good free party is that it shouldn’t be motivated by financial gain. Entry should either be free, or at most require only a small cover charge to meet the organisers’ expenses. Also in this context we understand the term “free party” to mean “free” in the sense that you’re being welcomed into a space without limitations imposed on expression or behaviour by the organisers.
He didn’t expand on why it is a “big requirement” perhaps he took it for granted that people understood it had to be free to not fall foul of the same license law that makes private parties exempt and requires a license for a public party.
I also read the partyvibe link “The Good Free Party Goer’s Guide”
written by partyvibe 11. And above all!
YOU ARE NOT CRIMINALS!
GOING TO A FREE PARTY ISN’T ILLEGAL!
DON’T LET THE [JUDICIAL] SYSTEM MAKE YOU INTO A CRIMINAL BY BREAKING THE LAW!
Peace, Love, Unity and Respect – The party vibe collective.
to be honest i cam back from the pub after a really nice evening to see your thread hijacking continueing. you clearly have such a narrow mind and cannot grasp what this thread is about, so i personally decided to try and discourage you from posting here, as you are being counter productive.[
(im sure I worded this bit better but its the jist but not as clear)
We all go to freeparties and we are all members of the public but we meet as a group of private enthusiasts and friends invite friends but public parties need tickets for all intents and purposes they seem private once a member of the public has purchased his ticket.
Private (free)parties only need an invite albeit by private means or to be more correct “not done for the public, so they can seem more open because they are not bound by the licensing restrictions but they can still fall foul of other laws. and if you don’t want to lose your system, your equipment, your records DJ’s are also liable, up to £20,000 fine and or imprisonment. You don’t say its public or advertise in the public domain as in open freeparty forums. I thought recent cases should of taught you this.
Your change of title still doesn’t make sense because raves are already legalized.
the essential arguement here between us is “what is a free party?” you appear to beleive that if we follow the law, the party is still free. i do not. by appearing to hold private parties, you are excluding members of society that would benefit from such an event. excuding them, because if you do not, the authorities will take, and i quote “your system, your equipment, your records DJ’s are also liable, up to £20,000 fine and or imprisonment” im sorry but “open to members of the public”, is an essentail part of what i define a rave as, and that is what is illegal, as you have just confirmed youself.
i feel as if i have already explained this, and that is why i got annoyed with you post and deleted it. it was not trying to stifle free speech, it was trying to keep this debate which you have misunderstood going in a positive manner. have you even read the whole thread?
if you wish to talk about invite only parties, start your own thread. i started this conversation, so beleive i have a right to control where it goes. if you wish to redefine the terms of the debate, then we are talking at cross purposes and you should start your own debate about how legal parties are if youu run them the way the law says you should.
i am incredulous that a man of your apparent intelligence and experience fails to grasp what i am saying, as i have made it painfully clear. therefore i had no choice last night but to assume you were deliberatly winding me up and trying to destroy the debate. if i’m wrong, then i appologise.
the essential arguement here between us is “what is a free party?” you appear to beleive that if we follow the law, the party is still free. i do not. by appearing to hold private parties, you are excluding members of society that would benefit from such an event. excuding them, because if you do not, the authorities will take, and i quote “your system, your equipment, your records DJs are also liable, up to £20,000 fine and or imprisonment” im sorry but “open to members of the public”, is an essentail part of what i define a rave as, and that is what is illegal, as you have just confirmed youself.
i feel as if i have already explained this, and that is why i got annoyed with you post and deleted it. it was not trying to stifle free speech, it was trying to keep this debate which you have misunderstood going in a positive manner. have you even read the whole thread?
if you wish to talk about invite only parties, start your own thread. i started this conversation, so beleive i have a right to control where it goes. if you wish to redefine the terms of the debate, then we are talking at cross purposes and you should start your own debate about how legal parties are if youu run them the way the law says you should.
i am incredulous that a man of your apparent intelligence and experience fails to grasp what i am saying, as i have made it painfully clear. therefore i had no choice last night but to assume you were deliberatly winding me up and trying to destroy the debate. if i’m wrong, then i appologise.
My two cents, having not followed the whole of this thread but shouldn’t the title say ‘unlicensed’ instead of ‘illegal’? 🙂
:hiding:you may have hit the nail on the head there:hiding:
I am NOT hijacking your thread, you are wrong fundmentaly and confused if I may say so, you are also bad mannered and I encounter your nasty personal attacks often when I try to make a point on whatever thread. Its strange to think that people that know us both thought we could get on, I understand why actually but until you get a reality check that’s not going to happen.
are you saying you want free parties, open to all with no restrictions because that’s just not possible. At the moment for all intents and purposes that’s what we have except we mustn’t be seen to bring it into the public realm. That’s the way it has always been I have also been trying to explain to you why it is impossible but tbh I don’t think you have really tried to understand what I have wrote and your personal dislike for me is clouding your view.
“i got annoyed with you post and deleted it. it was not trying to stifle free speech,.”
“i started this conversation, so beleive i have a right to control where it goes.”
I have kept to the subject, that’s stifling free speech in my book 😉
At the moment Free(rave) parties are legal as long as they are not done for the public. Remember we are all members of the public and no one is excluded from coming, we can use private means such as word of mouth. And the public can find places like this and join our groups, we just can’t advertise events publicly or say its public to the authorities. Raves done for the public in a public manner are legal as long as you have a license and that’s NOT going to change. I cannot understand why you cannot grasp this.
I am however willing to debate this.
Getting currently illegal free parties legalised?
currently free parties are not illegal. A unlicensed party or a licensed party becomes illegal when it breaks the law or a senior officer decides that he should use the Public Order Act.
Getting currently illegal free parties legalised?
currently free parties are not illegal. A unlicensed party or a licensed party becomes illegal when it breaks the law or a senior officer decides that he should use the Public Order Act.
Have you not wondered why every rig that goes out to a freeparty doesn’t get summonsed every time, if freeparties are illegal.
oh yeah you want to be able to invite the general public, you can you need a license, so I still think you need to change what you are trying to get because the wording does not make sense. neither does your attitude.
So which part of the law do you want changed.
Do you want to be able to invite the public without having a license or to have a license that says you can have a freeparty without the restrictions and cost everyone else has to have.
i think this is the crux of our disagreement. everything is possible. to me you sound like the sort of person, who would have said 70 years ago, that it isnt possible for blacks to have equal rights. have some faith, otherwise nothing will change.
Originally Posted by elraveon … are you saying you want free parties, open to all with no restrictions because that’s just not possible.
Originally Posted by Use … i think this is the crux of our disagreement. everything is possible.
how would that be possible to have no restrictions, in what reality 🙂 your just talking plain nonsense, there’s no other way to put it.
Originally Posted by Use … to me you sound like the sort of person, who would have said 70 years ago, that it isnt possible for blacks to have equal rights. have some faith, otherwise nothing will change.
your not very nice are you and bordering on very nasty which is only shadowed by your pre-conception and pre-judgment. If YOU had read half and had tried to understand a quarter of what I say, YOU would see I think all human beings should have equal rights and it is possible but black, white or yellow they don’t have equal rights, not here or anywhere that I know of. And it’s unlikely I would make any difference between colour or race ffs. I don’t think we have equal rights NOW that’s all I go on about and why I have such a dislike of the aristocracy and the class system. And while YOU and others are in denial of the class system and its discriminatory ways akin to racism and while you have your head in a bucket its unlikely Britain or the world for that matter will have equal rights, and while we have this inequality and acceptance of class, its not possible to expect many people to act with humanity or behave with respect to others or their surroundings. We don’t have equal rights now black or white, its why we cant have freeparties now the way you want or though its to subtle for you too grasp, all you can see is me objecting, where is I want the same as you but there is only so much that is possible while we have a class system and age old inequalities in place. So…………………DON’T TELL ME TO HAVE FAITH, wake up yourself! And look around; Open your eyes and mind, instead of making insidious remarks because you don’t know what you are talking about.
Tbh I would expect this kind of nastiness that emanates from your replies to me from the other place but from a moderator on here, I must say I am surprised and incredulous at the venom in your remarks, the lack of understanding, judgmental personal comments and censorship that I have received from YOU since I was asked to make comments on this forum several months ago.
first off, let me appologise absolutely for deleting your post. it was a supperssion of freespeech, and completely unacceptable. let me also appologise for making you feel victimised and unwlecome here, it has been my problems concerning my huge ego which have prevented me addressing the points which you raised. i am thouroughly ashamed of how i have behaved, and i have no excuse. i am really sorry for the way this thread has turned out, and my part in creating the climate of petty bickering and sniping that has occcured. the only temperence i give to my appology is that the conflict has not been a one way street.
i was not claiming that you would agree with such a system of discrimination, merely that you would not beleive that such a change in society is possible. im sorry you ttok what i said as an accusation of recism, that was not my intention.
i do not perceive myself to be indenial of the class system and i am at a loss as to ascertain where you formulated this veiw. however, it has become clear to me that i have communicated my ideas in this thread less than effectively, so do not place the blame for this understanding at your door.
i agree that unliscenced public freeparty/raves which i have been organisingfor some years are highly unlikely to ever be tolerated or legalised. the motive for starting this thread is that i beleive that while this is unlikely (and in your veiw impossible) it is possible. by changing the way a lot of the less agreeable events of this nature are conducted, and the way society veiws said events by the manipulation of the media to express the sofar unrepresented positive aspects of the events.
this thread was a debate started and subsequently stifled by myself. i obviously was not ready to hear the full spectrum of opinions on teh subject, adn it is my own failing. all i really wanted was for people to help me come up with furthur strategies to realise my own desires (however impossible in your opinion). teh title was misleading, but i was not deliberately misleading others, i was in self denial.
i hope, despite the snide comments i have made, that we can find some common ground on which we can base a more respectful dialogue. i do not expect to ever agree withyou on this issue, i think both our veiws are too entrenched. all i ask is that you look to yourself to aid this process as i alone am not capable. thank you for sticking around for the sake of the debate despite the difficulties that have ben in your way. i hope we now understand each other a litte better.
this thread was a debate started and subsequently stifled by myself. i obviously was not ready to hear the full spectrum of opinions on teh subject, adn it is my own failing. all i really wanted was for people to help me come up with furthur strategies to realise my own desires (however impossible in your opinion). teh title was misleading, but i was not deliberately misleading others, i was in self denial.
I understand what you are saying and of course what ever I say is just my opinion but there are goals that we can reach and I would like to make a contribution to your debate and I will try to be more constructive but we have to get past this title which is wrong maybe I could suggest something along the lines of “how can we stop freeparties from becoming illegal” or “how can we make freeparties more acceptable” or “how we can get freeparty legal sites” I don’t think sites would work how you would want but anyway that’s up to you, I wouldn’t disagree however with the title 😉
i hope, despite the snide comments i have made, that we can find some common ground on which we can base a more respectful dialogue. i do not expect to ever agree with you on this issue, i think both our views are too entrenched. all i ask is that you look to yourself to aid this process as i alone am not capable. thank you for sticking around for the sake of the debate despite the difficulties that have ben in your way. i hope we now understand each other a litte better.
cool well said tbh I wouldnt of bothered if I didnt care. I would like to say more now but I have had a long day and you have made the last few days a bit hard I have some adventuring to do tommorow so I need a break now, so when I get back lets see where we can get.
🙂
sound, i think i will have a think and try and formulate a better thread for the discussion of these issues, as i think this one is a bit battered now by our conflict. tahnks for taking the time, and i have been feeling pretty battered by this issue as well, so i totally relate to having o take a break.
heres to our dialogue becoming more constructive.:alcoholic :horay: :cloud9:
Gooood flamewar you two:horay::horay: Such as you don’t often see nowadays. Properly vituperous, quite personal at times, and even with bold faced shouting:lol_teeth:lol_teeth:lol_teeth. Always entertaining when pragmatism and idealism mis-understand each other (for people on the sidelines who can see the sense in both arguments – being in amongst it is not usually terribly entertaining. On the plus side, you both got to let off some serious steam, and a good growl can be quite a catharsis), Nice to see you made up too – not a common result of a flamewar usually…:bigsmile:
:hiding:………………Is it done yet…………….:hiding:
And would this be a good time to post a link to
http://www.albion.com/netiquette/
Remember – to paraphrase Mr Miyagi….FLAME ON……….FLAME OFF.
So’s everybody knows where they stand.
Possibly a new smiley or two could be found to suit the purpose…:ar15:…or :you_smart:get_you:
Anyhow. On the original subject (or at least, I think it is the original subject), I think the way to stay clear of the long arm of the law is to make parties private, but do what organisers have always done, and use word of mouth to spread the word.
The whole advertising/flyers nonsense is a holdover from clubs anyway – When I started partying, we didn’t get flyers or whatnot – we just knew someone who knew someone who had the partyline number, and would ring it at the weekend to find out where and when…
And making it a private party (and doing it on private land) means when the old bill turn up you can refuse to let them in without a warrant…:-) Which is usually quite satisfying (just make sure they have no complaints from the neighbours to use to shut you down first.)
The idealist in me swears fluently about having to jump through the hoops, but the pragmatist says that that is what will have to happen until I’m rich enough to afford a kamikaze rig for each time I want to party.
:bounce_m::bounce_m::bounce_m:…:bounce_m::bounce_m::bounce_m:…:bounce_m::bounce_m::bounce_m:…:bounce_m::bounce_m::bounce_m:
Roll on the commando rave rig….
new word of the day:
Vituperrious
Vi`tu*per”ri*ous, a. Worthy of vituperation; shameful; disgraceful. [Obs.]
you live and learn, eh?
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