@process 404086 wrote:
dirty fucking bastard. been undercover for nine years?! thats pretty hardcore that. :crazy_diz
I would hate to think of his mental state, cant be good for you.
the song “Michael Caine” by madness is actually about an undercover agent suffering mental illness and losing his own identity…
another thing to bear in mind is that even most middle level drug dealers only shift a few grands worth of drugs, in most cases issues caused by them can be dealt with by the SNT (local bobbies) and the existing local NHS mental health teams.
OTOH by their own admission/boasting on various eco-sites the environmental campaigners allegedly caused a £1.5 million loss of business to an energy company on one successful action alone.
Even assuming that only 5% tax would have been paid to the govt on this business (I picked the figure as its the VAT on a energy bill, the total figure might well be more), thats £75 000 lost to the government. That could pay a years salary for two young detectives, and have a bit of cash left over..
Whilst I think trashing the environment is a fucking stupid idea and that its good to make people aware of environmental issues, once campaigners start hitting organisations in the pocket the attacked organisations will still want to hit back, and energy companies are an essential part of modern life..
@partymonkey 402018 wrote:
ever since i saw undercover police with dreadlocks ect at waveform festival ive been paranoid as hell thinking that someone might try and deal to them.
how do you know they were OB?
@1984 404154 wrote:
how do you know they were OB?
how?!
@smokeitup 404043 wrote:
speaking of undercovers…
“activist” Mark Kennedy/Stone from Nottingham has been exposed as undercover pig.
UK Indymedia – Mark Kennedy/Stone exposed as undercover cop
makes me feel sick..
spoke to someone who told me a bit more about what happened with this guy. he had been going out with some girl for 6 years before he was discovered! :hopeless: that is fucking wrong. this girl is obviously in pieces now. what a total cunt. surely he can not have been paid that much to make it worth while. think she should get some kind of compensation or something…
@process 406931 wrote:
spoke to someone who told me a bit more about what happened with this guy. he had been going out with some girl for 6 years before he was discovered! :hopeless: that is fucking wrong. this girl is obviously in pieces now. what a total cunt. surely he can not have been paid that much to make it worth while. think she should get some kind of compensation or something…
raises some interesting ethical questions that. He wasn’t involved in animal rights groups by any chance was he?
@process 406931 wrote:
spoke to someone who told me a bit more about what happened with this guy. he had been going out with some girl for 6 years before he was discovered! :hopeless: that is fucking wrong. this girl is obviously in pieces now. what a total cunt. surely he can not have been paid that much to make it worth while.
Perhaps being able to do stuff like that – to get deep inside the enemy camp and infiltrate them to the point of getting that level of trust was what made it worthwhile for him? TBH for actions of this level I think it goes deeper than money.
I think he isn’t going to get paid that much more than a normal detective – and suspect something must have happened in that man’s life what made him hate eco-protestors so much that he got his revenge in this manner – rather than just even becoming a normal cop or rentaguard or joining a racist knuckledragger type group which would have given him as much chance to have a pop at lefties..
I’m not a doctor but I do wonder if his squint (which I would have thought would otherwise invalid him out of the constabulary) might have been caused as a long term result of injuries, maybe being beaten up by a “leftie protestor type” early in his career? That would give someone motivation to do such a thing for revenge, especially if he had wanted to become a firearms officer as whoever hit him obviously fucked up his career there.
On a much less devious note I have encountered folk what used to be ravers/party heads and have since become coppers. I haven’t always been able to find out why in all cases – but I know at least some of them have had such negative experiences in the drugs/party counterculture they feel wholly justified in fighting against that.
Even a lot of feds/MI5/journos when they finally divulge their actions defend them to the last and have rationalised the betrayal as they genuinely feel their enemy poses a threat of some sort or other. many are not particularly
Espionage is far from an easy job compared even to being a normal adversary in a battle..
Incidentally one of the indymedia commenters made a really good point about a culture of machismo existing within the left-wing activist movement and how it was this what led to them being infiltrated.
@1984 406939 wrote:
raises some interesting ethical questions that. He wasn’t involved in animal rights groups by any chance was he?
it was the more hardcore “activist” end of the environmental protest movement he was monitoring.
That said a lot of AR and eco groups do stuff like take jobs within companies they disagree with to find out inside info, or to introduce surveillance equipment. OK its not as long term a deep cover op as what this copper did but the techniques are the same..
another thought – say a copper infitrated a extremist religious organisation and foiled a bomb plot. Would everyone here be cursing him or her or celebrating?
@General Lighting 406949 wrote:
it was the more hardcore “activist” end of the environmental protest movement he was monitoring.
That said a lot of AR and eco groups do stuff like take jobs within companies they disagree with to find out inside info, or to introduce surveillance equipment. OK its not as long term a deep cover op as what this copper did but the techniques are the same..
another thought – say a copper infitrated a extremist religious organisation and foiled a bomb plot. Would everyone here be cursing him or her or celebrating?
see to me it shows how seriously they have to take these groups. I know when I did aviation security they spoke about how most terrorist groups are that are a threat are in the UK and animal rights/environmental groups.
It wont be popular but 2bh I think its probably a good thing that the cops have people looking into groups like that. Its not kind and its not nice but then neither is the way certain political groups chose to behave. Or at least its a counter argument to the assumption it must have been a bad thing to do. And I do like to try and see both sides if I can.
We only have to look at what happened to the Huntingdon Life Sciences lot and the hell they put people through.
to be fair even some of the Indymedia lot pointed out that the despite all this info cops didn’t totally break the movement nor stop all the protests (and of course they could have done)!
I am both an environmentalist and an engineer.
Shutting off a “nasty polluting coal fired station” even for a few hours might not seem like a big deal but if it happened at the wrong time it could cause all sorts of bad things to happen, leading to large power cuts.
Is complex to explain in depth but this is because the electric grid is linked up so each power station can supply energy to hundreds of miles away, but the infrastructure to do this is about 40 years old in some areas and investment has been starved due to privatisation.
If this happened, to get the lights back on would use 10 times more energy than the protest saved, and would put loads of people at risk even more so than peak energy will do anyway. so I can even understand why they’d go as far as putting in a cop just to keep the level of protest action down. Peoples lives and livelihoods are at stake.
the best “protests” are things like setting up working small scale renewable energy, reducing consumption and actually making sacrifices such as less non essential travel rather than trying to tell others what they should do..
@General Lighting 407050 wrote:
to be fair even some of the Indymedia lot pointed out that the despite all this info cops didn’t totally break the movement nor stop all the protests (and of course they could have done)!
I am both an environmentalist and an engineer.
Shutting off a “nasty polluting coal fired station” even for a few hours might not seem like a big deal but if it happened at the wrong time it could cause all sorts of bad things to happen, leading to large power cuts.
Is complex to explain in depth but this is because the electric grid is linked up so each power station can supply energy to hundreds of miles away, but the infrastructure to do this is about 40 years old in some areas and investment has been starved due to privatisation.
If this happened, to get the lights back on would use 10 times more energy than the protest saved, and would put loads of people at risk even more so than peak energy will do anyway. so I can even understand why they’d go as far as putting in a cop just to keep the level of protest action down. Peoples lives and livelihoods are at stake.
the best “protests” are things like setting up working small scale renewable energy, reducing consumption and actually making sacrifices such as less non essential travel rather than trying to tell others what they should do..
luckily I just finished watching a 3 hour long doc on the national grid (BBC4) so I do understand some of that 🙂
reminds me of the animal rights protesters who let free loads of mink from a farm whom promptly ate all the local wildlife including the otters (think it was otters, or their food supply).
As well as otters, the native European Mink, the Polecat and Pine Marten were displaced by the released American minks. Caused absolute fucking havoc in the ecosystem of these creatures. The European Mink is now endangered!
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