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Forums Life Politics, Media & Current Events UK : East : Greene King hits back at nimbys

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  • Raise a glass 🙂

    Its not very often I defend companies against local people – but its a local company that provides many jobs here, and TBH the rich old fart had an appeal, plenty of dialogue with GK and a Court cases – he should simply have walked away and accepted defeat at the first court case.

    He’s clearly got the time and resources to moan and whinge but as a retired architect he’s someone with enough brain in his head and life experience to realise that if you live in the street down the road from a pub there might be a bit of noise.

    If its really that bad there’s plenty of places he could move to round here with absolutely fuck all, no pubs, no shops, just houses where people like him can spend the remaining days of their pathetic lives complaining about everything..

    FFS Its only an hour until midnight as well for weekends, not even a 3am license…

    Quote:
    A RETIRED architect who protested against a pub’s late opening plans told last night how he feared having to take out a new mortgage on his home after being threatened with legal action by the owner.

    When brewer Greene King applied last year to extend the opening hours of the Dog and Partridge, in Crown Street, Bury St Edmunds, dozens of residents joined forces to protest.

    They challenged the pub’s bid to stay open until midnight on Fridays and Saturdays first at the council, and when that failed, at the magistrates’ court.

    But the group – led by Church Walk-based Simon Harding, 64 – lost both appeals against the change in opening hours, though in April magistrates turned down Greene King’s requests for costs.

    The magistrates’ decision is now being challenged by the brewing pub chain, which is going to the High Court’s costs division to seek £29,000 in costs from the four residents who challenged them in the magistrates’ court.

    Greene King has defended its action, claiming it merely sought to establish the principal that people should contribute towards the costs of cases they lose in court.

    But the four residents involved fear the brewer’s actions might put other concerned home-owners off protesting against licensing changes in the future.

    Martin Whitworth, 82, of Crown Street, told how he was left “flabbergasted” when he opened the letter from Greene King.

    “The figure is for all the people and the costs and the paperwork involved. We were flabbergasted when we opened the letter.

    “If they win, we could have to take out a mortgage on our house. And we don’t need that at our age. I am 82 and my wife, Sheila, is 80.”

    But Mark Angela, managing director of the Greene King Pub Company, said: “We are not challenging the four people who brought the appeal, but the magistrate’s decision not to award costs. We want to establish the principle that people should have to contribute to the costs of cases being heard a second time round.

    “Otherwise, if all objectors could appeal without ever having to pay any costs, there is a real threat to the thousands of community pubs across the country. We will not be looking to recover more than the appellants can easily afford.

    “When applying for our new licence for the Dog and Partridge, we listened to the concerns of the residents and wider community. We made considerable concessions as a result.

    “The Licensing Authority did consider a number of other demands made by local residents but dismissed them. Having already had their say, four people decided to appeal against the council’s decision and to insert new demands not included in the original hearing. They went ahead with the appeal in the full knowledge that if it was rejected, given that this was a second time round, there could be cost implications for them.

    “We are sensitive to how our pubs should be run in the communities we serve and we are sorry that this dispute has arisen, especially after having spoken to the residents at length during the appeal process.

    Im with you on this one GL,If you lose a court case youve lost the case end of story,They Should have just left it and accepted defeat gracefully.

    I am with the company here too.

    I used to live in a central part of a city and when I moved there it had a thriving pub culture, staggered closing times and several nightclubs in the area as well. I loved it [despite the noise and chaos there was sometimes :weee:].

    A couple of years later some uptight folks moved into this area and then started to whine about the noise being made etc etc due to all the pubs and clubs. They whined and whined and setup a residents association which I strangely never got letters to after they discovered I liked the pubs and clubs.

    The upshot of this story is that 8 or so years later the area is a desolate wasteland, most of the pubs and all but one of the clubs are gone. The closing times for the pubs are all simultaneous and the disruption this causes is far far worse than the previous disruption caused before they started; along with more violence and mess too.

    And the residents association is now living with the consequences of getting what they wanted and not enjoying it much. The area has changed in nature and they dont like what they got after all:you_crazy:you_crazy:you_crazy

    The moral of both these stories is think through what might actually happen if things dont work out as you want them to as a result of changes you are asking for – once those changes are made you cant go back.

    This is Greene “take over the remaining small breweries and close them down” King. Greene King who, who having survived the takeover revolution of the 1970s, are now doing just the same themselves to smaller breweries.

    I don’t feel glad they won anything.

    leveret wrote:
    This is Greene “take over the remaining small breweries and close them down” King. Greene King who, who having survived the takeover revolution of the 1970s, are now doing just the same themselves to smaller breweries.

    I don’t feel glad they won anything.

    its true they’re a big corporate; and I’ve read a fair bit of dirt about GK but its also a matter of the principle (and my own local interest, I now live not too far away)

    A lot of smaller “rave-type” events in this area depend on being to use such venues as larger pubs with late licenses.

    Its hard enough as it is dealing with the Police without well-heeled nimbys keeping on protesting and getting the hours knocked back….

    had a feeling you might be a real ale buff 🙂

    Hmmm… dangerous precendent. It could deter the common folk from suing when they have rightful cases for fear of being stuck with the bill for a corporate defense team.

    I am not sure most people would sue after losing a licensing meeting they were at?

    Where do we draw the line?

    Was the pub there when these folks moved into the houses?

    And why could they not have made some concessions to ease the process along? [eg. we don’t like the idea but would be prepared to tolerate it once a month or something similar? They could always wear earplugs that one night of the month and it would have given their council something to work with]

    itsupnorth wrote:
    Hmmm… dangerous precendent. It could deter the common folk from suing when they have rightful cases for fear of being stuck with the bill for a corporate defense team.

    I understand your fears – but (especially having some local knowledge of the area and populations where this incident happened) I don’t think this guy is exactly “common folk” – nor were his actions particularly reasonable.

    He is a well-off pensioner who made the personal choice to live next to a pub; knowing that people get a bit merry and noisy..

    He stubbornly refused to accept a small extension to the pubs opening hours – took it to two Council appeals (at considerable cost to the local council tax payers) and then when he lost those to two Court cases…

    If this chap launched a civil action against a party promoter for excessive noise and did the same thing (going for a further case after losing the first,) I wonder if people here would be so quick to defend his right to take such action?

    Dont think so :you_crazy bet they would be grumbling about it for ages

    the building dates back from the 18th century and used to be the live-in home of the chief brewer of Greene King (i.e it should be obvious to anyone with half a brain that this place may get converted into a pub!)

    Not sure when the pub conversion was done but would expect it has been a pub for some years. If I’m ever in the centre of BSE I may even investigate out of curiosity…

    Many of the residents complaining (including this chap) lived a few streets away rather than directly opposite it :you_crazy

    another thing which does potentially affect a lot of people on this site is that if these nimbys can get their way, Studio 3 (as a late night opening venue) could be next in line for their attention – I’ve seen reports in various local rags from nimbys whinging about this place….

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Forums Life Politics, Media & Current Events UK : East : Greene King hits back at nimbys